• Same Lyrics Challenge - VOTING closed!! - RESULTS ARE IN!!
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Re: Same Lyrics Challenge - VOTING thread!!
Reply #30 on: November 12, 2018, 20:14:33
Hey @Bill from November Sound and @Mar T. , yes the small range of scoring is currently a bit of a problem. In practice it means it's hard not to give the same score to quite a few of the songs, even if they are not all of equal merit ( well to my ears anyway)

Why not just multiply the number of contestants by 3 points, then have a max score of 6, as Bill suggests for top score. In the case of this challenge, with 12 entries, that would mean 36 points available. A contestant could only vote for 11, but the following range of scores might have been given by him/her as an example

6 points x 1 song = 6
5 points x 1 song = 5
4  x 4 songs.          = 16
3 x 1 songs.          = 3
2 x 2 songs.          = 4
1 x 2 songs.          = 2
                               = 36

Which does help to stretch out the field, and more easily identifies the voters clear favourites.

Cheers

M




Hi @MichaelA , check, thanx for your message. You can look at this from many angles.
Too many points per option, for example, has a downside: we might risk people to vote quickly (give a few songs max points) when they're 'in a hurry'. Or we might see more contestants scoring lower than we're used to.
From my point of view we achieved a good balance keeping max points per option at the current levels.
Having said that, I'm absolutely fine to expiriment with it, eg, next time try a higher max per option like @Bill from November Sound and you suggest.
I'm a bit careful though, we must be sure to have enough backing from our regular contestants, because most of the regular contestants seem to be fine with the way voting works right now. So let's see where consensus is. Who else is in for an expiriment?
Cheers!
Mar T.
:mart:


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Re: Same Lyrics Challenge - VOTING thread!!
Reply #31 on: November 12, 2018, 21:17:37
Hey @Bill from November Sound and @Mar T. , yes the small range of scoring is currently a bit of a problem. In practice it means it's hard not to give the same score to quite a few of the songs, even if they are not all of equal merit ( well to my ears anyway)

Why not just multiply the number of contestants by 3 points, then have a max score of 6, as Bill suggests for top score. In the case of this challenge, with 12 entries, that would mean 36 points available. A contestant could only vote for 11, but the following range of scores might have been given by him/her as an example

6 points x 1 song = 6
5 points x 1 song = 5
4  x 4 songs.          = 16
3 x 1 songs.          = 3
2 x 2 songs.          = 4
1 x 2 songs.          = 2
                               = 36

Which does help to stretch out the field, and more easily identifies the voters clear favourites.

Cheers

M




Hi @MichaelA , check, thanx for your message. You can look at this from many angles.
Too many points per option, for example, has a downside: we might risk people to vote quickly (give a few songs max points) when they're 'in a hurry'. Or we might see more contestants scoring lower than we're used to.
From my point of view we achieved a good balance keeping max points per option at the current levels.
Having said that, I'm absolutely fine to expiriment with it, eg, next time try a higher max per option like @Bill from November Sound and you suggest.
I'm a bit careful though, we must be sure to have enough backing from our regular contestants, because most of the regular contestants seem to be fine with the way voting works right now. So let's see where consensus is. Who else is in for an expiriment?
Cheers!
Mar T.
:mart:

As a relavily newbie contestant , I "wholeheartedly" support what @Bill from November Sound & @MichaelA have said on the voting system.
Dakoda
(I've expressed a little frustration with it before, if there happens to be one song thats a clear winner in my eyes, the voting system seems skewed
to prevent me expressing that, I can see an argument for not making the differentials too large so no one gets disheartened with a really low relative score, but in my opinion it's too far skewed , which makes it not fit for purpose)
 
I prefer poisoner to fish chef...


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Re: Same Lyrics Challenge - VOTING thread!!
Reply #32 on: November 12, 2018, 23:58:08
« Last Edit: November 13, 2018, 00:20:16 by Mar T. »
Ok @Dakoda , thanks to you as well for your comment. Seems that there's demand for 'a bit' more room to the voters to express 'their clear' winner.

We can achieve that by increasing max points per option OR decreasing total points a voter can give away.
Plz, kitcheners feel welcome to keep the suggestions coming in, so we have a clear picture of what we (as a community) want.

Cheers!
Mar T.
:mart:

PS The fact that this leads to frustration is not our intention at all. Please do consider that our vision behind these challenges is to encourage songwriting (and the assignments often lead to inspiration and helping (at least some of) us out of their writer-blocks), in a friendly and not too competitive environment with some humour here and there.
We changed the name from 'competition' to 'challenge' for that reason. We've learned that a competition aspect (deadline, assignment, voting) makes these challenges work because they cause us to challenge ourselves.
So we're not losers when we don't win. On the contrary. We're all winners. Winners because we have challenged ourselves and joined a kitchen event together. So let's not take 'winning' too seriously. It's more that a deadline, an assignment and voting are ingredients (we're in a kitchen aren't we hehe) in a recipe, that has proved itself, because it helps us being creative and start writing. AND listen to each other because we're all into the challenge.
I'm amazed by every entry so far in all these years, no matter how well they 'scored' in the results.
I hope that makes sense..

But as said: let's tweak it a bit, so everybody is happy!!


EDIT: few typos and I'm really bad at explaining my point in one shot. Haha. Ok I'm finished!


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Re: Same Lyrics Challenge - VOTING thread!!
Reply #33 on: November 13, 2018, 12:34:23
Just to chime in on the voting discussion.........

I am personally comfortable with the protocol as it is. I find that the number of points available is just right for me to spread my appreciation around. But in my mind, I am not trying to determine an outright winner........I am hoping, instead, to encourage folks to take part while at the same time leaning my appreciation toward songs that have shown the most improvement from the writer or that resonate a bit more with me.

Remember, folks, we changed this from a contest to a challenge to try to move away from that winner/loser aspect a bit.

"The main thing is to have a gutsy approach....but use your head." Julia Child

 "In a world of robotic conformity, the only originality left in music is the imperfections" Eric Craptone

"Special thanks to Steve Gleason for making me who I am today." Leonard Scaper

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https://soundcloud.com/vincentgleason


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Re: Same Lyrics Challenge - VOTING thread!!
Reply #34 on: November 14, 2018, 17:38:55
meanwhile  ;D ;D ;D ;D don't forget to vote!  ::thumb:: ::thumb:: ::thumb:: :whistle: :whistle: :whistle: :whistle: :whistle:

perhaps we can have some of those "I voted" stickers or emblems made for the kitchen ?
me, myself, and Pie


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Re: Same Lyrics Challenge - VOTING thread!!
Reply #35 on: November 15, 2018, 10:36:42
Voted

 ::Rachel::
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Re: Same Lyrics Challenge - VOTING thread!!
Reply #36 on: November 15, 2018, 12:15:37
I enyoyed listening to you all, what a beautiful challenge !!!

::heart::**** VOTED **** ::heart::




ps. I like the voting system as it is
also a goat understands a joke


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Re: Same Lyrics Challenge - VOTING thread!!
Reply #37 on: November 17, 2018, 00:39:17
17 votes in and only 2 days left for voting kitcheners! I can sneak peak that 1 entry is clearly in the lead!

Keep voting everybody, the submitted songs are a pleasure to listen to. Voting closes 19 nov 8:00 pm (forum time)..

Cheers !!
Mar T.
:mart:


Re: Same Lyrics Challenge - VOTING thread!!
Reply #38 on: November 18, 2018, 14:51:01
I think we all are in agreement that this is a challenge not a contest. I'm fine with the voting basically as it is ... but it would be nice if I could have given one of the entries 4 points.   :thumbsup:  That's what I wanted to do, oh well.

The challenges are a great experience. The entries are all amazing and I think everyone wins because: we create music that we wouldn't have created, we are forced to make a deadline and we have to share our music with others.
Heck, we all forced @MichaelA to actually make the song out of some lyrics he had kicking around somewhere....  :D ... seriously, though, thanks for letting us use those beautiful lyrics!

Out of all the challenges I've done this one has created the most "practical" song for us.  As cool as the song "Plastic Smile" is, we're kind of hesitant to perform it live with all it's quirkiness of lyrics, bizarre tempo changes, etc..   But, here, with "Two Hearts in the Snow" we've already been performing it out at gigs. Within a set of classic Christmas Songs there's no question ... people even start singing along by the second chorus.  :yes:

Good luck to all. Thanks for the opportunity!   
Bill
Songwriter, Keyboards, Arranger, Producer & Engineer for November Sound

November Sound is based on the Mother, Father & Son musical trio of Melissa, Bill & Will. I'm the father so anything I post will have my wife singing and/or my son playing percussion.


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Re: Same Lyrics Challenge - VOTING thread!!
Reply #39 on: November 18, 2018, 23:25:51
I voted. Finally!

Sorry, I don't have enough time nor energy to comment on all entries individually. But I listened to the playlist (provided by @oorlab , thanks for that!) many times in the past weeks and I think that this challenge has generated a bunch of incredibly good songs, without exception. Congratulations to all participants, and especially to @MichaelA who wrote these wonderful lyrics. I love this kitchen!
::headphone:: ::headphone:: ::headphone::

Cheers,
Mark


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Re: Same Lyrics Challenge - VOTING thread!!
Reply #40 on: November 19, 2018, 03:05:30
« Last Edit: November 19, 2018, 03:08:00 by Mar T. »
Thanks  for voting everybody We currently have collected 18 votes!! Just a about 16 hours left before I close the voting poll.
Live points sneak preview: we have a clear winner, as well as a clear 2nd and 3rd position. (in the 41-36 range)
The 4th ranking is shared between 2 entries.  (currently both at 35 points)
The 5th place has 34 points.

Rest of the entries have 33-21 points. (that's what I love about the current voting config: the (generally perceived as 'best') songs win AND the (generally perceived 'less perfect') entries all scored a lot of points as well. That still makes me doubt if we should change the poll configuration formula.

I'll give you the results later today (voting is still open, so  :pompom: go go go if you didn't vote yet!  :pompom:).

Cheers!
Mar T.
:mart:


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Re: Same Lyrics Challenge - VOTING thread!!
Reply #41 on: November 19, 2018, 12:02:59
Yes @Bill from November Sound , if it wasn't for this challenge this song for me would have been just a discarded idea. Instead we have a dozen or so new songs, so I couldn't be more pleased. It is great to think that these lyrics that sat scribbled in my songs rough workbook are now, for example,  being sung at a Christmas market some 3000 miles or so away from the book itself where those lyrics still live. Very cool!  ::thumb::

I also agree with you @Mark Luto  that we have a very consistent and high standard of songs this time - one of the best challenges, I think, for the consistent level of quality. Plus we've seen some talented new faces, so I hope they stick around. ;D

FInally @Mar T. , well if the voting results have worked out as you say, then it's hard to argue with your scoring logic. I think Bill's last comment is a good idea, but I think my own idea , on reflection, probably sucks! Ha ha!  ;D  :lol: Sorry, I will continue with my medication and see where I get to!
If you like novels with a musical theme, why not try 'Sixth Beatle - When Music Changed The World', easily found on Amazon and Google. It is amazing, although as the author I may be biased!


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Re: Same Lyrics Challenge - VOTING thread!!
Reply #42 on: November 19, 2018, 13:57:00
...I voted too :) well done to all participants! I liked the theme of this challenge - it was interesting to listen to all the varied outcomes for the same set of lyrics :)
Rachel  ::Rachel::
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Re: Same Lyrics Challenge - VOTING thread!!
Reply #43 on: November 19, 2018, 18:26:58
Thank you for your last minute votes @Rachel_D !! And of course everybody thanks for voting!
Since nobody seems to be voting anyomore at the moment I locked the poll and I'm proud I was invited to present the results to you,  in this thread later this evening (it's already evening here in Holland).

Stay tuned!! And let's hear that drumroll!!
Cheers!
Mar T.
:mart:


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Re: Same Lyrics Challenge - VOTING closed!! - RESULTS INCOMING!!
Reply #44 on: November 19, 2018, 19:18:26